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Adrian Erickson Publicly Discusses his Upcoming Documentary Release
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Christopher Noel
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 Posted: November 13th, 2010 10:47 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Erickson speaks during the second hour of the show, along with his research partner, DNA analyst Dr. Melba Ketchum. Erickson talks for about five minutes, and Dr. Ketchum for the rest of the second hour. (The first hour's guest is David Paulides, who, as many of us know already, is also well worth listening to.) I found Dr. Ketchum's discussion of her team's analysis of Sasquatch tissue and hair samples to be riveting and inspiring of trust. The bottom line, according to her, is that her team's research results will be written up in the form of a comprehensive article by the end of November, at which point the article will be submitted for scientific "peer review." When it clears this hurdle, it will be published in a scientific journal. Doctor Ketchum's best estimate for time of publication, if all goes well, is spring, 2011. At that point, according to Erickson himself, The Erickson Project documentary will be released; the reason for waiting is so that all the strongest evidence (video, audio, DNA, etc.) will be in position to be made available to the world at the same time.


http://www.blogtalkradio.com/bigfoo...t-busters-radio

(Edited by Christopher Noel)
There are two possibilities, and two only. Either Sasquatch does not exist--in which case all of the thousands of sincere eye-witness accounts, as well as centuries of Native American wisdom, are false--or else it does exist, and if it does exist, it has survived alongside Homo sapiens only by being far more elusive than Homo sapiens can imagine.
 
 
Christopher Noel
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 Posted: November 13th, 2010 03:05 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

To me, the important news here is that we are finally hearing something more defnitive than ever before from the two principal engines behind this project. And it is clear from listening to both Erickson and Ketchum just how careful and deliberate is the conduct of this research, so that, upon release, the combined body of evidence will be able to wishstand healthy scrutiny, if not hold-out, irrational skepticism.
There are two possibilities, and two only. Either Sasquatch does not exist--in which case all of the thousands of sincere eye-witness accounts, as well as centuries of Native American wisdom, are false--or else it does exist, and if it does exist, it has survived alongside Homo sapiens only by being far more elusive than Homo sapiens can imagine.
 
 
Bossburg
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 Posted: November 13th, 2010 05:44 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

We will see. Around 60 days ago Ketchum and Paulides claimed (on Coast-to-Coast AM) the big release would happen in about 45 days. Also, over the past few years Adrian has said the documentary would be released toward the end of that year. They have tried to build up anticipation about a big release which they claim will impress everyone, but it has never materialized.

We will see.

Bossburg
 
 
Christopher Noel
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 Posted: November 13th, 2010 06:18 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I certaintly echo Bossburg's basic skepticism, but I'm also choosing to put a hopeful spin on the situation, assuming that these repeated delays may legitimately be attributed to an "abundance of caution" on the part of those in charge. Put yourself in their shoes: you might be just about ready to release your body of evidence, and then here comes some better, bolstering data, so let's hold the presses, and then you are, once again, just about ready to share what you've got, but wait, the product will be even more convincing if you can include THIS great new piece of evidence...etc., etc... Theoretically, I don't see anything wrong with continuing to enhance the ammunition in good faith like this--even at the risk of frustrating a breathless research community...a small price to pay, in the long run--especially in anticipation of what will SURELY be an all-out assault by mainstream science, which historically fights to the death to preserve its dominant paradigm. Every building block of solid science you can include that will help to blunt these inevitable attacks is like a piece of pure gold.
There are two possibilities, and two only. Either Sasquatch does not exist--in which case all of the thousands of sincere eye-witness accounts, as well as centuries of Native American wisdom, are false--or else it does exist, and if it does exist, it has survived alongside Homo sapiens only by being far more elusive than Homo sapiens can imagine.
 
 
IH 460
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 Posted: November 13th, 2010 09:06 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I as probably everyone here sure hopes and prays this evidence will indeed by substantial. That will make it well worth the interminable (or so it seems) wait.
 
 
Bossburg
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 Posted: November 13th, 2010 09:45 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Chris, yes, that's very hopeful, because Adrian has not had anything new to add to his package for a few years now. The DNA effort is sketchy due to the discrepancies between Paulides claims and Ketchum's claims regarding the hair samples. Paulides said the only hair samples that mattered were the hair samples with follicles (containing DNA). Paulides said those were a small minority of the hair samples they have, but when asked by the host of the radio show how many follicle samples there were, he could not give a straight answer and neither could Ketchum. Paulides just said "a lot" and Ketchum said "I'll have to check on that." Ketchum's inability to give even a ballpark figure of how many matching hair-DNA samples they have makes their claims of imminent revelations seem questionable.



Bossburg
 
 
CharlesL
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 Posted: November 15th, 2010 01:17 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I listened to the show last night. I, too, have been anxiously awaiting the release of Erickson's documentary. Waiting, and waiting, and waiting... I fear that the longer this evidence is withheld from the public the greater the chances that it will prove to be anti-clamatic when it is released. Perhaps it's not as astounding as some of us have been led to believe? I don't know. I just know that it's become wearisome to hear about this project but not actually see it completed.

My other complaint about this show was that the host seemed to be trying VERY hard to insinuate that Patterson and Gimlin are hiding some important details about the Patty film. He apparently wants us to beleive that Patterson and Gimlin were using dogs to hunt down the bigfoot in the film. The host was careful to say he believes Patty was a real bigfoot, but then he goes on to make the dogs comments without providing any references to back up his claims.

I'm not impressed with the host. Was he smearing Patterson and Gimlin merely to drum up more interest in his show? I hope not. Those two men have suffered enough ridicule and suspicion already.
 
 
Simplicity
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 Posted: November 17th, 2010 05:45 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Well, it is a wait, that's for sure..

But........If they believe that it's taking so long in order for them to get it right, then i'd wait for however long it takes persoanlly ( even though i'm as impatient as anyone )..

Of course though the other side of the Coin is perhaps they simply are just not happy enough with what they have & are not completely confident of releasing it as it is..

At least however there IS some stuff being leaked publically now, that must be a step forward at least..
I have a feeling something BIG is gonna happen withn the world of the Big Guy soon.. Just a hunch of course..
 
 
Fronkey776
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 Posted: November 17th, 2010 10:23 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

@Simplicity - What stuff has been leaked out? Were you referring to the timeline or did they release some evidence of some kind?
 
 
Christopher Noel
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 Posted: November 17th, 2010 11:46 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Bossburg, do we know for sure that Adrian has not added anything new to his body of evidence for a few years?
There are two possibilities, and two only. Either Sasquatch does not exist--in which case all of the thousands of sincere eye-witness accounts, as well as centuries of Native American wisdom, are false--or else it does exist, and if it does exist, it has survived alongside Homo sapiens only by being far more elusive than Homo sapiens can imagine.
 
 
Polypodium
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 Posted: November 17th, 2010 10:07 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

From what I have heard, he has more than most people realize.

Dr. Bindernagel has been making the Blogtalk rounds and he answered one of my questions with a firm yes, he believes Mr. Erickson's video footage collection is the real deal and he has been privy to them on 3 occasions. He also said he found them quite compelling with facial details showing canines, brow ridge and so on.

I am glad that this topic is finally allowed to be discussed. Between the upcoming BFRO show, the possible DNA evidence from Dr. Ketchum along with the Erickson Project it is certainly an exciting time for this phenomena. I'm glad to be on the sidelines of it all.
 
 
Simplicity
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 Posted: November 17th, 2010 10:09 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Fronkey776 wrote:
@Simplicity - What stuff has been leaked out? Were you referring to the timeline or did they release some evidence of some kind?


The Trailer for example, the fact that Erikson is now talking about it, as opposed to a couple of Months back & beyond, where we heard nothing publically virtually, at all..

You have seen the Trailer yeah ??
I have a feeling something BIG is gonna happen withn the world of the Big Guy soon.. Just a hunch of course..
 
 
PBYodeler
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 Posted: November 17th, 2010 10:56 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Christopher Noel wrote:
Bossburg, do we know for sure that Adrian has not added anything new to his body of evidence for a few years?


What we know and what we can talk about are two completely different things. The only things that can be discussed here is what Adrian has revealed himself. The BFRO is not involved in this "project" and as it's still under copyrights that we have no control over so, everyone, no more questions about the content of his project. If Adrian didn't talk about it himself it's off limits here.
PBYodeler
 
 
Simplicity
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 01:13 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Cool, in that case then here's the Trailer for those who maybe haven't seen it, enjoy..

http://sasquatchthequest.com/engine...qfs_trailer.flv
I have a feeling something BIG is gonna happen withn the world of the Big Guy soon.. Just a hunch of course..
 
 
Christopher Noel
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 04:32 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Polypodium, do you have a link to that Bindernagel appearance?
There are two possibilities, and two only. Either Sasquatch does not exist--in which case all of the thousands of sincere eye-witness accounts, as well as centuries of Native American wisdom, are false--or else it does exist, and if it does exist, it has survived alongside Homo sapiens only by being far more elusive than Homo sapiens can imagine.
 
 
TheShadow
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 06:08 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/mnbrt/...ohn-bindernagel

Here ya go Mr. Noel
Be forewarned: Canadian and Minnie Soda accents abound
Addresses the Erickson footage at around 84 minutes
I particularly like when Dr Bindernagel mentions that the southeast US (and he mentions my state GA in particular) is prime for discovery... a hypothesis I happen to share.
Jeff (Scantily Haired Hominid)
The more I learn about Sasquatch the more I think they have the right idea: Sleep all day, eat whatever you want, and avoid the hell out of mankind!!!
 
 
Christopher Noel
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 10:34 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Thank you! Also, I've just listened to another show with Bindernagel where he talks more about Erickson.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...OSA8Zh8-9O8uzBQ

He begins talking about Erickson at about the 26-minute point, and I found his discussion very reassuring, as it affirms what I've been hoping and presuming is true. Here's a bit of what he says: "I just visited Adrian last month [Oct. 2010] and he's been going through [what I went through in the seven years of writing my new book]. Let's add one more piece of evidence, then let's just add this. Because of the resistence to this subject we all want to put our best foot forward and not put a foot forward until we really think it's convincing. That's my interpretation of where he's at. Adrian has some really good stuff."

Listening this Bindernagel, one is struck by the understated care with which he expresses himself; in other words, he is not a man given to hyperbole. So for him to say "really good stuff" is significant.

I'd highly recommend this episode of "Bigfoot Busters," for Bindernagel's many other insights as well.
(Edited by Christopher Noel)
(Edited by Christopher Noel)
There are two possibilities, and two only. Either Sasquatch does not exist--in which case all of the thousands of sincere eye-witness accounts, as well as centuries of Native American wisdom, are false--or else it does exist, and if it does exist, it has survived alongside Homo sapiens only by being far more elusive than Homo sapiens can imagine.
 
 
Navigator
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 12:38 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Chris,

There's four (4) separate things involved here, which you and everyone else needs to keep separate.

1) Adrian's overall documentary.
2) The squatch footage from Kentucky contained in the documentary.
3) The possible DNA samples that Melba Ketchum has.
4) The article she claims will be written about her findings.

The only thing we can be confident about is the footage from Kentucky, because so many people associated with the group have been to the location and have either seen those sasquatches themselves, or seen some or all of the KY footage.

As for the overall documentary, Adrian says it will include footage from other places than Kentucky, but apparently the other footage is rather unremarkable, perhaps a notch or two above questionable YouTube stuff. The core of the documentary is the KY footage.

The DNA study is a completely separate thing. Ketchum received hair samples from several sources, including the BFRO and from Adrian Erickson (from the KY site) and from Paulides. She claims she has gotten some interesting results, but several things about her claims are quite questionable, unfortunately. We'd all love it if a respected university was involved in her study. And we'd be pleased as punch if the study was led by a respected geneticist that has published something in a scientific journal at least once before, but neither of those things are true in this case. Furthermore, she is allowing a known liar like David Paulides (who was forced out of the San Jose police department for fraud in the 1990's) to be the spokesman for this project. Paulides is known to be a major liar and exaggerator by several prominent people on the bigfoot scene, including me and John Green and Steven Streufert, etc.

For example, Paulides tells people that the BFRO has targeted him for attacks because he claims bigfoots are related to humans, whereas we say they are related to Gigantos. That's another bull**** story by Paulides. Yes, I kinda suspect sasaquatches are closer to Gigantos than humans, but I know my speculation may be incorrect. It doesn't really matter to me one way or the other at this stage, and various people in the BFRO believe they are some type of humans. There's a whole array of different possibilities actually.

But Paulides tells people that the BFRO, and me in particular, wants to persecute him for his different opinion on this issue, as if we regard him as a heretic who must be burned at the stake. Bull**** !! We could care less what anyone speculates on that issue, but Paulides profusely lies to people saying that we are out to get him because he believes they are related to humans. It's classic Paulides bull****, designed to manipulate people and explain why we outted him about his checkered past with the San Jose police department, and his many lies and misleading boasts since then.

Again, nobody knows what they are, and it makes little difference if they are non-human or human. Neither scenario is dramatically more remarkable than the other. If they are non-human that is just as fabulous and fantastic as if they are related to humans. Clearly they are primates. Where they separated from our line is an interesting question, but it is kinda peripheral. I'm perfectly OK with whatever the case may be. A genetic connection with hominids or humans is one of many obvious possibilities. If anything can be proven either way, that's just dandy. The more important thing is to prove THAT THEY ACTUALLY EXIST.

Now he is saying that Ketchum's DNA will prove that they are humans. That would be great if it were true. I have a problem with her project, but not because they are claiming it will prove they are humans. That's more deception by Paulides. I have a problem with her project because many things just don't add up with their claims, and it seems there's a lot of exaggeration going on. I don't think they can prove anything with what they have. I strongly doubt they will be able to publish anything in any scientific journal, because the peer review process with tear them to pieces. They don't have DNA that indicates something non-human. Rather, they have DNA samples which indicate human genes. The DNA samples were handled (and potentially contaminated) by humans, so therefore the DNA could have easily come from the humans who handled the samples. Ketchum herself says the DNA primers she uses are so sensitive that they have been known to amplify the DNA of a single human skin cell that drifted through the air and landed on a hair sample ...

The bottom line .... if the DNA indicates humans, then her scientific peers are not going to acknowledge that bigfoot exist and are related to humans. Rather, her scientific peers are going to assume (and perhaps rightfully so) that her DNA samples were contaminated.

Until there's a full dead specimen of a sasquatch, from which DNA can be taken in controlled, sterile circumstances, then it will be impossible to convince scientists that DNA, which appears to be human, proves that sasquatches exist and are related to humans.

You can mark my words, there will be no "big release" next Spring. Adrian may release his documentary, but don't count on an article in a scientific journal about Ketchum's DNA findings. Instead, you can expect lots of hype from Ketchum and Paulides, and then lots of excuses later on, and possibly some conspiracy talk to explain why they could not deliver, again.
 
 
Tyler H
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 04:08 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Now, that post is a tough act to follow.

I do find it interesting as well, that the trailer does basically zilch in mentioning or showing anything related to the KY Footage. That, coupled with the supposedly leaked bit of that footage a few years ago, coupled with the delays, makes me feel that footage has been vastly over-hyped.

Still crossing my fingers though, as I too had been telling people for years "just you wait until that KY footae comes out - it's supposed to make everyone a believer."
Tyler Huggins
BFRO Investigator, Alberta
 
 
Polypodium
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 09:43 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Christopher Noel wrote:
Polypodium, do you have a link to that Bindernagel appearance?


Hey Chris,

So you have the link to the MNBRT Radio Show, and Bigfoot Busters above. Here is a third show that I know of, Bigfoot Quest. I do not recall to much Erickson stuff on this show but informative none the less.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/bigfoot_quest

I understand you will be a quest on one of the above shows in January. I look foward to tuning in.

Cheers



 
 
Fronkey776
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 Posted: November 18th, 2010 10:22 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

And that's why he is known as the Navigator. Well said, I agree with you 100%
 
 
Andrew-ND-Ape
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 Posted: November 19th, 2010 01:26 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I am totally neutral on this and I know it would be hard for most people to sit and listen to the whole 2hrs of this chat but ...... Toward the very end of the radio blog with Ms Ketchum, she seems VERY adamant that she has: "more than covered all the bases" to ....."get it passed any peer review process". I am no DNA expert but she seems to know her stuff and seems sincere enough.

She did not come across as a publicity hound or a complete bluffer to me, BUT she may be associating with some. Hopefully she wont be guilty by association. As the BossB said: "we'll see"
Wildman or Camper's Boogieman? We'll see.....
 
 
Navigator
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 Posted: November 22nd, 2010 06:22 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top



It makes little difference if Melba claims she has "more than covered all the bases". The scientific process dictates that many *independent* scientists must be able to replicate her results, not whether they think she has "covered all her bases".

So there would need to be enough hairs, etc., with enough DNA from each separate sample to distribute to independent recognized academic authorities, and those authorities would need to come up with the same results and agree with her conclusions. That would take a long, long time, but that is not what is happening. What is happening is a lot of hype about having proof but not revealing the proof, and also claiming the release will happen in the near future, but then repeatedly pushing that back by several months.

Where have we seen it happen before where someone(s) claim to have the final proof in hand, but for some reason they can't actually show it until some undetermined point in the future?? Who does that sound like?

If what they are claiming is true then I highly doubt they'd be touting their supposed achievement long before they can actually show something. No, they would keep it quiet until something actually gets published. y
 
 
ApesAmongUs
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 Posted: November 23rd, 2010 01:10 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I agree Navigator. What's with all the grandstanding, and build-up? If what you have is so groundbreaking, why all the delays?

I don't buy the cover, that they are getting all their ducks in a row for the scientific community.

Hate to sound like a cynic, but let's see what you got already? Quit talking about it.
 
 
Navigator
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 Posted: November 23rd, 2010 01:59 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Something else is at play as well ... it's a juvenile mentality that is ultimately self-defeating. For years I have called the mentality the "Edmund Hillary Fallacy".

It is called the "capture the flag" mentality in other contexts.

(Sir) Edmund Hillary was the first man to climb to the summit of Mt. Everest. It was a big achievement. It made him a celebrity and eventually a "Sir".

For decades some petty people in the bigfoot research world (starting with Rene Dahinden) have cited the Edmund Hillary case. Rene would say the first guy to reach the summit is the one who goes down in history, and everyone else is forgotten. Hence, the first person to "discover" bigfoots will become a celebrity and go down in the history books, and everyone else will be forgotten.

On a more subtle level, the first person to reach the summit will be able to turn around and denounce all his rivals as incompetent.

It's a petty, macho, juvenile mentality ... and Hillary himself did not think that way.

Some would say there's a place for that type of competitiveness, even if it is childish at its core. But in certain contexts, such as bigfoot research, it creates problems in various ways.

The BFRO tries to purge that fallacy out of its members. We've always said the real prize is persuading the general public of the existence of sasquatches. For us it's not a race to "capture the flag" of discovery. We're seeing our prize slowly materialize in recent years, so we know we're going in the right direction.

The mere concept of capturing the flag, or being first to the summit, in the bigfoot context, is a total fallacy. It won't happen that way. There won't be a single personality who will be credited with the "discovery" to the exclusion of all others.

But when the Hillary fallacy infects an individual, or a group of people ... the people infected start doing things differently. The behavior and decisions and tactics transform the effort into something self-serving and often deceptive. The infected people begin jockeying for pole position, rather than focusing on the animals and bringing forth the evidence to show they exist. They focus on the benefits they expect to receive and eventually they try to reap the rewards before they've even delivered anything.

If the Hillary-minded "researchers" have something new and interesting for show-and-tell (but that's all) they'll nevertheless try to inflate the extraordinariness and certitude of what they have, rather than letting it speak for itself. But the longer they hype what they have, while still keeping it under wraps, the more one should doubt that they have anything certain or extraordinary.

Paulides and Erickson and Ketchum are all infected by this capture-the-flag mentality. It is turning them into deceptive salesmen who will stir up hype in advance, but will ultimately disappoint all those who got excited by the hype.

They are fishing for financial support at this time, ostensibly to help them give birth to the proof, but what they have will not be accepted as proof by the scientific community. Either they know that now, or they will figure that out eventually.

If they see serious skepticism on the horizon before they actually release anything, they'll opt to keep the situation eternally pregnant (while holding out hands asking for financial backing). In other words, if their primary purpose is to grab attention and respect for a discovery they claim is unquestionable and unassailable, and they start getting some of that attention and respect before they actually unvei what they have ... then they will continue on that path and never unveil what they have, knowing that it will certainly be questioned and assailed when it is released, no matter what.

Even though *much* of what Erickson and Ketchum has (both the visuals and the hard evidence) derives from real sasquatches ... they still do not have what they claim to have: The "final proof" to convince all the scientists. Rather, they have some new show-and-tell items that could help build more public interest and acceptance .... if those items are not over-played and over-hyped. But there's already a lot of overplaying and over-hyping going on.

Building up what they have into such a trophy (in order to inflate themselves as champions) will, ironically, set them up for rejection and failure.


(Edited by Navigator)
 
 
IH 460
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 Posted: November 23rd, 2010 09:27 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

One thing that always amazes me that hasn't happened (at least to my knowledge) is an orphaned BF baby being found which has had a mother die of illness, or accident, etc. Or for that matter even a blind or injured BF of any age stumbling into where the would be easily discovered or found by humans. If and when that ever happens all this evidence competition will be instantly rendered pretty much of lesser signficance.
 
 
narrowfoot
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 Posted: November 23rd, 2010 11:33 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

How often is a baby gorilla or chimp found wandering alone? My guess is that such an infant would be cared for within its group, possibly by a grown sibling. Probably the same is true of the aged. They would not be left alone to stumble into human areas.
"Technological advances are not limited to human populations."
 
 
SwiftSpear
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 Posted: November 25th, 2010 08:09 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
IH 460 wrote:
One thing that always amazes me that hasn't happened (at least to my knowledge) is an orphaned BF baby being found which has had a mother die of illness, or accident, etc. Or for that matter even a blind or injured BF of any age stumbling into where the would be easily discovered or found by humans. If and when that ever happens all this evidence competition will be instantly rendered pretty much of lesser signficance.

I'm of the belief that bigfoot are tribal. Disabled members of the tribe are either cared for or purged the same way any other body would be, as with any human tribe.

[edit] I just wanted to state that I'm really happy to see this thread. I've been wanting to ask about the Ericson project and what not for a while now, but someone had said somewhere that any discussion of it was swept under the rug. I know not alot can be discussed for various reasons, but even just hearing other members who have been more exposed to the situation than I have give opinions I think is tremendously revealing for me as to what to expect.
 
 
Bossburg
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 Posted: November 25th, 2010 08:32 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

SwiftSpear: Swept under the rug? Oh, how wrong you and whoever 'they' are. We, the BFRO, we not allowed to talk about it because it is under copyright and we had NO authority from the owner to open discussion. Now that the trailer has been released, we can talk abou that...but we are not going to discuss the documentary because it has not been released. Have you seen it? No, I don't think so...so there is nothing to talk about. Take note of what is being discussed here - evidence, likelyhood of evidence, time tables - nothing about the documentary.


Bossburg
 
 
WillyG
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 Posted: December 2nd, 2010 02:35 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Will someone in the Erickson camp please tell him to lose the mullet!!! lol
MichiganCarGuy
 
 




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