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Navigator
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 398

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 06:54 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Folks, we need some help with something important ...

We need a little bit of your time, especially if you've attended at least one BFRO expedition.

When you do a Google search for "BFRO Expeditions" (which is what many people will do when considering going on an expedition) you will see links to several different outside message forums.

These links usually point to threads where someone initially asked "Has anyone here ever participated in a BFRO expedition?" then like clockwork someone pops up saying "No, but I've heard that many people think they're a scam" yada, yada ..

But the person saying this never bothers to mention where he "heard" these assertions originally ...

When I've asked in the past, or had others ask, where those people heard that, their links of substantiation always points to the same place: bigfootforums.com

Even though it is not an organization like the BFRO, but rather just a message board, some people on that web site began a propaganda campaign in 2005 to discourage people from participating in BFRO expeditions ... because the BFRO Expeditions tend to make us more popular, and prove the BFF people wrong in the process.

Expedition attendees quickly figure out that the BFF is little more than a misleading propaganda machine.

The BFF propaganda machine actually achieved its aim when someone saw a question asking about BFRO expeditions, on some obscure forum, and then did a Google search and found the strictly anti-BFRO threads on the BFF ... where BFRO members and supporters are not allowed to confront the anti-BFRO assertions.

Those anti-BFRO threads always had other BFF people hopping in, saying "yeah, yeah, that's right, they suck, lets all hate them" or words to that effect.

In other words, people who have NEVER attended a BFRO expedition were partly able to create a misleading perception on the Internet about these important, historical efforts ... mainly because no one contested those assertions on those obscure forums.

That it is not surprising, in a sense, because the odds are not good that a former participant is going to be a member of some random paranormal message forum on the Internet, because there are so many of those paranormal forums around.

The bottom line: BFRO members and supporters need to help counter-act this BFF-originated propaganda.

Here's what you can do, easily:

1) Do a Google search for "BFRO Expeditions" to look for those threads. Then join those message boards. If you've attended a BFRO expedition, tell them so. Set them straight about the expeditions, and how this "scam" propaganda got started on that rival web site, the BFF.

2) If someone else has not done so already on that forum, start a new thread asking the same kind of question: "Has anyone ever attended a BFRO expedition?" then let others on this (blue) forum know about your thread so they can reply.

Yes, nothing can stop envious BFFers from going to those same threads and continuing to talk crap, but the truth will shine through.

The simple fact is, at this point in time, there are MANY MANY MORE expedition attendees than there are obsessive liars on the BFF.

The people who are considering attending future BFRO expeditions should not be falsely prejudiced by envious people who have never attended these trips.


 
 
Navigator
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Posts: 398

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 06:58 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top



I had to delete the initial post (saying the same thing) because this forum system would not let me edit it.
 
 
AlanF
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Posts: 144

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 07:37 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I was going through some of the anti-expedition/BFRO comments from other forums. It seems a fellow named "pywacket" of the BFD is one of our biggest haters. He accuses of us of all kinds of things. Mr. Pywacket I know his real name but won't use it was caught on a game cam sneaking into the woods with a boom box on a ***** outing while newbies were being taken out in another direction to listen for bigfoot whoops and howls. At first he denied this entirely but when confronted with the evidence (photograph) he said he was doing it to see if newbie's could tell the difference betweeen real howls and call blasted ones. He just forgot to tell anyone later he was out there doing it.
The whole thing was outed on Melissa Hovey's Search for Bigfoot forum and she labeled him a hoaxer. By that way that forum has as far as I know always been open and honest concerning BFRO comments. Mr. Pywacket is one of the in crowd at the BFD so I find it interesting he accuses us of doing something he himself got caught at. When you read something consider the source and make up your own mind.
I don't bring this up to start a war or bash anyone or anything but to say when you dig into some of the anti-BFRO rhetoric you'll find more to it than at first meets the eye.
Alan F.


True Insanity is to do what you've always done then expect a different result.
 
 
minnesota dave24
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 Posted: December 5th, 2008 08:01 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

when i read their forum its like they dont even believe in bf anymore the only thing they believe in is that the bfro is evil. they are so blinded by their hate, their whole website is just complaining and griping. i still plan on attending at least one exped. maybe more this year. but not having done one yet is there a way i join in the sanctification of the BFRO name against this apostate sect. if so let me know how.
Many things go 'bump' in the night, things that wouldn't scare you at all, if you could see 'em go bump in the light. - My New Mantra-

Minnesota Expedition 2009
 
 
AlanF
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 Posted: December 5th, 2008 08:25 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

One of the main reasons I chose the BFRO is that they don't allow bashing on this forum. I think my post is close to crossing that line so if it is I apologize beforehand and hope an administrator removes it.
I don't want to see the threat hijacked into a bash the BFD platform. If you go on an expedition and feel you got something out of it as Navigator says don't be afraid to say so on other forums. If you ask the critic if he/she has ever gone on one you'll either get no response or a no I haven't with excuse. I love people that criticize without first hand knowledge.
Alan F.


True Insanity is to do what you've always done then expect a different result.
 
 
PBYodeler
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Posts: 3063

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 08:37 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Alan's right but I'll leave his post up as it shows one example of what Navigator is talking about. This thread is a request for help so anyone that's interested can follow Nav's instructions and if you just tell the truth and ask honest polite questions that prompt them to show why they think the way they do then things will begin to fall into place.
PBYodeler
 
 
minnesota dave24
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Posts: 185

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 08:48 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

i apologize as i do feel i crossed the line. i will keep it Pro BFRO not DOWN with the BFF. again i am sorry.
Many things go 'bump' in the night, things that wouldn't scare you at all, if you could see 'em go bump in the light. - My New Mantra-

Minnesota Expedition 2009
 
 
PBYodeler
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 Posted: December 5th, 2008 09:06 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

No need to apologize. As long as we do our best to just push them for proof of their accusations and don't stoop to the level of bickering like little school girls we'll be fine.
PBYodeler
 
 
Squatchgirl
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 Posted: December 5th, 2008 09:51 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I wish we all could just get along things would be so much better : )
Cindy
 
 
AlanF
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 144

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 10:13 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Squatchgirl wrote:
I wish we all could just get along things would be so much better : )


Unfortunately Cindy that's not going to happen for a variety of reasons. A lot of people have gone to expeditions and had various reactions. Some got so scared being out there at night they would never go again. To hide the fact that fear got the best of them it's easy to say the expedition was lousy. There other reasons to blame the expedition not the people too.

Some don't think ordinary folks should be bigfooting it demeans the image of the "professional researchers." They can't see that exposing people to the species benefits the animals and us.

Some don't want anyone to be the "first" but them. Toot your own whistle and demean all others. The egotists I guess.

Finally the two worse kinds. The ones that know they exist and will do anything to make sure that truth doesn't come out. They have economic reasons to submarine all research that points to this species being real.

And finally, the truly ignorant that refuse to accept any evidence regardless because in their mind it's closed BF doesn't exist period. This mentality ran the Inquistion, sat at the Salem Witch Trials and has been around for a long long time.

Human nature is human nature.
Alan F.


True Insanity is to do what you've always done then expect a different result.
 
 
XionComrade
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 10:26 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Navigator wrote:
Folks, we need some help with something important ...

We need a little bit of your time, especially if you've attended at least one BFRO expedition.

When you do a Google search for "BFRO Expeditions" (which is what many people will do when considering going on an expedition) you will see links to several different outside message forums.

These links usually point to threads where someone initially asked "Has anyone here ever participated in a BFRO expedition?" then like clockwork someone pops up saying "No, but I've heard that many people think they're a scam" yada, yada ..

But the person saying this never bothers to mention where he "heard" these assertions originally ...

When I've asked in the past, or had others ask, where those people heard that, their links of substantiation always points to the same place: bigfootforums.com

Even though it is not an organization like the BFRO, but rather just a message board, some people on that web site began a propaganda campaign in 2005 to discourage people from participating in BFRO expeditions ... because the BFRO Expeditions tend to make us more popular, and prove the BFF people wrong in the process.

Expedition attendees quickly figure out that the BFF is little more than a misleading propaganda machine.

The BFF propaganda machine actually achieved its aim when someone saw a question asking about BFRO expeditions, on some obscure forum, and then did a Google search and found the strictly anti-BFRO threads on the BFF ... where BFRO members and supporters are not allowed to confront the anti-BFRO assertions.

Those anti-BFRO threads always had other BFF people hopping in, saying "yeah, yeah, that's right, they suck, lets all hate them" or words to that effect.

In other words, people who have NEVER attended a BFRO expedition were partly able to create a misleading perception on the Internet about these important, historical efforts ... mainly because no one contested those assertions on those obscure forums.

That it is not surprising, in a sense, because the odds are not good that a former participant is going to be a member of some random paranormal message forum on the Internet, because there are so many of those paranormal forums around.

The bottom line: BFRO members and supporters need to help counter-act this BFF-originated propaganda.

Here's what you can do, easily:

1) Do a Google search for "BFRO Expeditions" to look for those threads. Then join those message boards. If you've attended a BFRO expedition, tell them so. Set them straight about the expeditions, and how this "scam" propaganda got started on that rival web site, the BFF.

2) If someone else has not done so already on that forum, start a new thread asking the same kind of question: "Has anyone ever attended a BFRO expedition?" then let others on this (blue) forum know about your thread so they can reply.

Yes, nothing can stop envious BFFers from going to those same threads and continuing to talk crap, but the truth will shine through.

The simple fact is, at this point in time, there are MANY MANY MORE expedition attendees than there are obsessive liars on the BFF.

The people who are considering attending future BFRO expeditions should not be falsely prejudiced by envious people who have never attended these trips.





Why can't we all just brush aside this childish bullshizza and do what we all want done(BFF, BFRO, BFD) And find these things? We are getting sidetracked way to easy with useless crap.... :S The money and fame comes AFTER the job is done....


Quote:
AlanF wrote:


Finally the two worse kinds. The ones that know they exist and will do anything to make sure that truth doesn't come out. They have economic reasons to submarine all research that points to this species being real.

And finally, the truly ignorant that refuse to accept any evidence regardless because in their mind it's closed BF doesn't exist period. This mentality ran the Inquistion, sat at the Salem Witch Trials and has been around for a long long time.

Human nature is human nature.



I thought I would jump in and give mine here too
Not all of the people that know that these people exist in the wild are submarining all of the evidence and fighting to keep them hid for economic reasons. Obviously global knowledge of such a mystifying and rare animal COULD cause their extinction very rapidly, you wouldn't even know what happened. This is a subject that has to be assessed from every angle at every moment(It takes time and yet may never be uncovered as we want it to be!). Just imagine how much one stuffed or captured for illegal trades would be worth? They would be extinct in decades! But since "They don't/Can't exist, it is just a fake rug and not the real fur!" If the common public doesn't know they exist, they don't know they can be hunted, right?!
But dead again global recognition may be the best thing to ever happen to them, it seems to me anyway that they do enjoy watching us from afar and are curious of our goings! But that one is a far greater stretch to me

It may be best to let those few people who want to know and are very interested know and those who just don't care NEVER know, for the protection of these Forest Giants.

It is good to have people who are rediculously opposed to all evidence, they open our eyes and allow us to rationalize, step back, and observe what is happening concerning the possitive evidence. Take it with a tablespoon of salt. :P We have to take our time with this subject, peoples reputations and life-works are on the line here, noone wants to die leaving a label of "Liar-Lunatic" to their Kids and Grandkids because they fell for the next big hoax.
(Edited by XionComrade)
 
 
thesaint
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 10:28 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Being just an observer here as well as on BFD ( I rarely make posts on either)...the BFRO do not allow dissention, whilst BFD allows quite alot so therefore what they discuss is wider in scope...which includes observations and criticisms of themselves and others......both sites to me play an important role, and I enjoy both, but because they are both different in approach, sadly neither will ever see eye to eye. Such is life. The BFRO definately has a right to respond to any criticisms and I encourage you to do so.
my little girl believes in bigfoot...
 
 
LissingMinx
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 476

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 10:33 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I made the mistake of giving my e-mail to a poster on this forum for something not Bigfoot related. He was soon banned and proceeded to send me several e-mails chock full of anti-BFRO propaganda. I looked at a little of it and quickly found it to be immature, nasty and, well, what we refer to as "butthurt" on a gaming forum I sometimes visit. Most of it was transparent as a crystal pane.

There were several accusations that seemed to come from Bob Heironimus (sp?) types. All claiming they were asked to join in on BFRO hoaxes. Some even claimed they were offered money to help with hoaxes. Uh, if BFRO was pulling hoaxes, why risk bringing so many outsiders in on them? Why did none of these people accept, document and expose the truth?

I nicely informed this person I'm no idiot, I can decide for myself and thanks anyway for the concern. Let's just say he got very nasty (again, my apologies to Boss and PB for being pulled into it) and the person's e-mail now goes directly to my spam/trash.

Sickening. I'm used to professional jealousies and even the occasional personal attacks resulting from differing viewpoints and debates in my chosen field, but this is just beyond me.

Anyone attacking BFRO needs to be asked why they aren't out collecting and presenting proof instead of running their mouths in immature and unsubstantiated attacks on the internet. Show me the evidence or shut the...heck up

D.
(Edited by LissingMinx)
Too many questions, not enough answers.
 
 
robday
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 844

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 10:39 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
AlanF wrote:


Unfortunately Cindy that's not going to happen for a variety of reasons. A lot of people have gone to expeditions and had various reactions. Some got so scared being out there at night they would never go again. To hide the fact that fear got the best of them it's easy to say the expedition was lousy. There other reasons to blame the expedition not the people too.

Some don't think ordinary folks should be bigfooting it demeans the image of the "professional researchers." They can't see that exposing people to the species benefits the animals and us.

Some don't want anyone to be the "first" but them. Toot your own whistle and demean all others. The egotists I guess.

Finally the two worse kinds. The ones that know they exist and will do anything to make sure that truth doesn't come out. They have economic reasons to submarine all research that points to this species being real.

And finally, the truly ignorant that refuse to accept any evidence regardless because in their mind it's closed BF doesn't exist period. This mentality ran the Inquistion, sat at the Salem Witch Trials and has been around for a long long time.

Human nature is human nature.


There's more...

Money, as they say, is the root of all evil.
Let's look at a hypothetical situation:
Several groups gather, each with the intent to run paid expeditions. If one rises above the others, there is an unbalance in the "competition", which exists whether intentional or not. Those that are not in the lead have a motivation to discredit the leader and any others that might take marketshare from their endeavor.

I'm not accusing any other group of this behavior. I'm just saying that the motive is there and can't be ignored. This same motive may be responsible for someone hoaxing their own expeditions (a guy with a boombox, for example).

This is small scale stuff. As Alan mentioned, there are big industries that stand to lose millions if a true discovery is made. I would EXPECT these big businesses to do whatever it takes to protect their interests. Discrediting scientific study is one way, hoaxing is another. Perpetuate a hoax, have it accepted as real, and then come forward with "new evidence" showing it is a hoax. This is a double whammy. It discredits research and BF groups while at the same time lending support to those that believe BF is a myth.

 
 
Smike
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 Posted: December 5th, 2008 11:12 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Isn't bigfoot politics obnoxious? Imagine how much more effective bigfoot research could be if the community wasn't so divided.
 
 
sneeky
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Posts: 50

 Posted: December 5th, 2008 11:23 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

The first anti-BFRO to come up when I googled it was The American Bigfoot Society Journal. I posted a postive reply about the BFRO. The second anti-BFRO to come up was the BFF. There are three topics posted since Nav posted his request. The first is titled "A special message from BFRO" and it has a link to Nav's post and is followed by......you guessed it, a bunch of anti-BFRO rants. The second two are titled "Who has been kicked out of BFRO and why?" and "Who has been on a BFRO expedition?" They are both posted by the same person with the screen name Rod. It doesn't sound like he supports BFRO. I am waiting to get approved. When I do I will post positive comments.
Todd
 
 
sneeky
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 50

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 01:56 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Just posted a positive recommendation for people to attend a BFRO expedition. I was the second one.
Todd
 
 
vilnoori
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 20

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 02:06 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

As a frequenter of several BF forums I just want to say they all have their strengths and weaknesses. I agree BFF can be contentious, since not a few skeptics and law enforcement, truth seekers hang out there. And perhaps there is a place for that, but one does take a risk posting sightings and experiences there. You have to have thick skin and be prepared to be gone over with a proverbial fine tooth comb.

The BFRO on the other hand is very organized and comprehensive, in fact I'd like to see it even more comprehensive than it is, to the point where it categorizes and indexes a database of ALL bigfoot related accounts received by researchers, not just those rec'd by BFRO researchers in particular. What a resource that would be for all of us!

People who embark upon expeditions of more than one risk being hoaxed, unfortunately, but if you are willing to take that risk, trusting in your ability to differentiate a true experience from fakery, and/or completely trust your guides and have no problem paying for it too, then more power to you. I hope you have a great time. Thankfully in my own area (Fraser Valley BC Canada) there are lots of leads to follow without taking the risk of having a lot of potentially noisy company.

Live and let live, I say. All have different styles and let's refrain from bashing each other since we all have the common goal of researching these fascinating creatures. There is plenty of good work yet to be done. We need to pull together.

edit to add, re post by sneeky, the BFF mods are often very sharp with Rod, who is rather liberal with his views. As you can see the thread you mention was shut down by the mods, they do not like BFRO bashing, tolerant though they are.
 
 
Phil
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 43

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 05:08 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
vilnoori wrote:
I agree BFF can be contentious, since not a few skeptics and law enforcement, truth seekers hang out there. but one does take a risk posting sightings and experiences there. You have to have thick skin and be prepared to be gone over with a proverbial fine tooth comb.



After one visit I can't get myself to join the BFF forum. It's full of arrogant ignorant administrators and I would recommend not giving them any business. Nothing good can come out of the way they operate and it certainly doesn't help in the quest for Bigfoot.
 
 
thesaint
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 05:59 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Phil wrote:



After one visit I can't get myself to join the BFF forum. It's full of arrogant ignorant administrators and I would recommend not giving them any business. Nothing good can come out of the way they operate and it certainly doesn't help in the quest for Bigfoot.


Sorry Phil, but I must disagree...BFF offers discussions on subjects and opinions regarding bigfoot without the fear of being booted off. It fills an important role just like the bfro does. We need both. I myself enjoy reading the posts both here and there, and I encourage others to do so.
my little girl believes in bigfoot...
 
 
Phil
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 43

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 06:17 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

If your being booted off it's probably for a darn good reason. I never seen anyone get booted on the BFRO that didn't ask for it. Should they allow things to get out of control? No rules? Hell, while were at it lets allow children access to porn.

I don't agree.
 
 
thesaint
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 06:29 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Phil wrote:
If your being booted off it's probably for a darn good reason. I never seen anyone get booted on the BFRO that didn't ask for it. Should they allow things to get out of control? No rules? Hell, while were at it lets allow children access to porn.

I don't agree.



Thats abit extreme.
We agree to disagree. Both bfro and bff have a role to play.
my little girl believes in bigfoot...
 
 
Phil
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 43

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 06:31 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I did notice a couple times when things didn't go the way the BFF administrator wanted and the party was booted. Very unprofessional, I wouldn't recommend this forum to anyone.
 
 
AlanF
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 144

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 07:43 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Getting back to the subject at hand. A true adage of life is you get what you pay for. I've seen people come on expeditions that wanted a camping trip so they got a camping trip. I've seen people come on expeditions that wanted knowledge of squatch so they attached themselves to BFRO people and left knowing more than they could ever read about the subject. I know I learned more in two nights in the swamps with Matt Moneymaker than I have found in all other places to date.

There's nothing secret in an expedition other than the attendee signs a legal agreement not to make the location known to others. Expeditions are teaching exercises too. BFRO people are expected to show and teach methods that have been tested time and again and work to the newer folks so they can use them themselves. Any evidence collected by the expeditioner remains the property of the expeditioner.

Finally, the expedition is the standard route one takes to join the BFRO. It allows the attendee to see what it is we really do and it allows the members to see and judge the person attending. Trust me its not about money there are many more rejects than approvals.

The bottom line is you decide for yourself what kind of trip your going to have. No one forces anyone to do anything. You can stay up all night squatching or you can curl up in your tent and read a book. If your the type that loves being in the woods, loves to camp, loves hearing the stories, loves the excitement and doesn't mind getting dirty its for you. If your idea of camping is a Holiday Inn Express your going to hate it.

Either way when you come back be honest and tell people why you liked it or why you didn't. Don't blame the BFRO on another board if it isn't your cup of tea be honest with your reasons.

The 2009 expedition season starts in a couple of months right here in my backyard so to speak. I hope everyone gets a chance to go on one sometime, somewhere this year. I know times are tough and I know a lot of people may have trouble coming up with the required fee but if you can you'll find the money well spent if you really take advantage of the opportunity.
Alan F.


True Insanity is to do what you've always done then expect a different result.
 
 
Andy
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 Posted: December 6th, 2008 10:36 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

I post here, and only here, because this is the best Bigfoot Board going.

The sheer quality of the discussions here is far and away superior to the discussions elsewhere (which often seem to pander to very young posters and their, er, sensibilities).

Better, there is an effort on the part of the BFRO to weed out hoaxes in their sighting reports and hoaxing or delusional behavior on the Board.

Best of all: nobody is nasty, nobody is foul.
This is something of an achievement for a 'net Board!

(Being removed from this Board usually has to do with the same sorts of things that your own mother would remove you from polite company for!)

Sooner or later, the people who are seriously interested not only in "finding" but also in understanding the behavior and biology of Bigfoot will find their way to the BFRO. A wheat-from-the-chaff process, if you will.

As for any other boards that bashes us?

My late, much-lamented mother used to say: Consider the Source.
(She'd usually add, "Don't get your blood in a bubble!"


seeing is believing
 
 
Bill Boqs
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 Posted: December 6th, 2008 11:52 AM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Andy: As usual, very, very well said. I have nothing against a multitude of "voices" within the crypto-community but, in time, some voices acquire more weight and credibility than others. Need a usable database of nationwide sighting reports? Do you have questions for people with relevant experience in the field? Do you want to participate in a lively, well-informed discussion without being personally insulted or having your ancestry questioned? If so, the choices narrow very quickly.
On the internet, no one knows you're a squatch. . .
 
 
AlanF
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 144

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 12:42 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Having moderated on a board at one time I know just how much work is involved in keeping one orderly. You always hear the "free speech, first amendment" argument when people feel they are being held back. The truth is free speech only applies to your own comments on your own page, NOT on a forum owned by others.

Science cannot move forward without debate. No great idea was ever just accepted and many times you risked your life in the past by challenging beliefs. People got tortured, imprisoned, burned at the stake, hung or shot for being seen as challenging authority by questioning established thought.

The difference I see between here and the BFF is if you get kicked here it's because you act like an idiot and/or blatantly disregard the rules, if you get kicked there it's because you challenged their ideas. That's a big difference !

If you present ideas here you should be prepared to debate and explain yourself. That's not attacking you as a person. Here we challenge thought not people.
Alan F.


True Insanity is to do what you've always done then expect a different result.
 
 
Jaylee
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 2

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 02:33 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Matt, contrary to what you think, there is no "propaganda campaign" against the BFRO, the BFRO expeditions or against you personally at the BFF. In fact, the staff there has been more than accommodating to the members of your organization. We have also given you a ton of free publicity for your expeditions.

[quote=Phil]After one visit I can't get myself to join the BFF forum. It's full of arrogant ignorant administrators and I would recommend not giving them any business. Nothing good can come out of the way they operate and it certainly doesn't help in the quest for Bigfoot. [/quote]

It's too bad that you feel this way about the administrators at the BFF Phil. But, you're welcome to your opinion of course, and I'm sure it won't hurt the 'business' of the BFF in the least. BTW, we are not actually a "business" over there. We don't charge anyone for anything, the staff is volunteer only and there are no plans in the future to change that. OTOH, the BFRO is a 'business' so the two are not in direct competition, in spite of what some people would have you believe.

Have a nice day.

Jaylee
BFF Administrator

P.S. I tried to add quote tags when I was quoting Phil, but I guess this forum doesn't let you quote people...dunno.
(Edited by Jaylee)
 
 
Oldfattylumpkin
Approved


Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 174

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 03:36 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Having never visited the BFF, I cannot comment one way or the other.
However, I have attended a BFRO expedition. I had a great time, learned a lot more than I ever thought I would learn, met great knowledgeable people (Hiya Bill Bogs, Hiya Andy), and even came home with a class B under my belt.

The fee I paid was well spent. I hope to attend another one next year.

Well there's my two cents


Dave D

P.S. Hay Bill, I got the video you sent me of Santa, FUNNNNNNY. I Loved it


I Squatch, Therefor I am.
(Clinton County, Michigan)
 
 
Bossburg
Administrator


Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3535

 Posted: December 6th, 2008 04:20 PM  Edit Post Delete post Back to top

Quote:
Andy wrote:
Best of all: nobody is nasty, nobody is foul.
This is something of an achievement for a 'net Board!

(Being removed from this Board usually has to do with the same sorts of things that your own mother would remove you from polite company for!)

Sooner or later, the people who are seriously interested not only in "finding" but also in understanding the behavior and biology of Bigfoot will find their way to the BFRO. A wheat-from-the-chaff process, if you will.


Thanks Andy.

The volunteer moderators here try to keep things in order and have a very good idea of who the trouble makers are...they show up (under various assumed names) at pretty regular intervals. As hard as the trouble makers try sometimes, they can't be nice for long and true colors shine with rude, nasty comments, attacks on others - including the admins. If they would place as much positive energy into their life as they do with negative, meaningless arguments, the world would be a better place.

We allow (no, we welcome) intelligent questions, discussions and comments. We've all learned volumes of information, some of which we take to heart, others that we file away. It's all good stuff.

I'm always amazed at those who come to the BFRO forum and complain about how we do things! Then why waste your time? Go away, go read somebodys blog or another forum where you can wallow around with others in the dirt. Personally, I used to read the 'other' forum and quit when I couldn't find anything but arguments and nasty comments. I was looking for bigfoot research - didn't find any.

Oh, BTW, Jaylee, we do have a few rules that are well known if you read any of our threads. Please visit the *READ THIS FIRST* section of the forum, read the posting guidelines and then post your introduction.

Thanks,


Bossburg
 
 




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