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Navigator
Administrator
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 292
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 Posted: March 10th, 2009 07:15 PM |
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Todd Prescott,
Please reply to this thread so people know you are available to take questions and flesh out the story on those tracks.
MM |
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todd0329
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 11th, 2009 12:40 AM |
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Todd Prescott is here and available for questions when the photos are up.
(Edited by todd0329)
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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streetmedic
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 11th, 2009 02:42 PM |
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To me it looks like rabbit, you can see imprints that could be the fore feet and a second depretion that could be hind quarters. The photos are not very cler and it looks like the traks have melted a bit.
On the positive side it looks like there are stagered a bit.
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 11th, 2009 06:43 PM |
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Quote:
streetmedic wrote:
To me it looks like rabbit, you can see imprints that could be the fore feet and a second depretion that could be hind quarters. The photos are not very cler and it looks like the traks have melted a bit.
On the positive side it looks like there are stagered a bit.
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Two other BFRO Investigators concluded the same - probable rabbit/hare prints. Unfortunately, the tracks at the time of the photos had degraded substantially. Expansion and melting of snow morphs the heck out of prints. I am still researching the area however, because of a history of possible BF related occurrences nearby.
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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brandon_rivello
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 353
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| Posted: March 12th, 2009 06:39 PM |
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| In the Ontario-One image, it looks like the first print at the very bottom of the frame is further apart from the other tracks than all the others. Any elements we can't see in the picture that could explain this, or is that just an optical illusion |
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 12th, 2009 07:22 PM |
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Quote:
brandon_rivello wrote:
In the Ontario-One image, it looks like the first print at the very bottom of the frame is further apart from the other tracks than all the others. Any elements we can't see in the picture that could explain this, or is that just an optical illusion
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Brandon - I believe it appears that way because the first print is so close to the photographer, whilst the next print is 7ft away. So... yeah... I guess you could call it an optical illusion.
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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Andy
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2308
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| Posted: March 13th, 2009 06:13 PM |
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These are great!
And just around the corner from me, too...fantastic!
***************************
For sure these are not horse prints: there would be two parallel lines of prints.
**************************************
You know, the rabbit/hare idea is interesting, though.
When a rabbit or a hare runs full-out, it doesn't sit its little fuzzy butt down onto the ground, but only its paws--which leaves a funny, very un-rabbit like print. There can be big distances--feet--between the prints of a running hare.
It actually looks more like a fox print or something when it does that (toes visible).
Hares are amazing to watch at a run--really an elegant animal; one of my favorites.
Rabbits/hares also do the full-leg & butt sit-hop when they are moseying along, and then that leaves the larger, fatter and very familiar prints, which are quite close together in "stride" & may even have the big back feet sticking out in front of the small front ones (forming a lumpy triangle). This is the one I see in my yard all winter.
Jackrabbits & European hares especially can do big (BIG)leaps at the run...no species of jackrabbits (aka hares) lives in this area...although you will get a snowshoe up just across the border like that, and also maybe European hares (I've never seen one).
Eastern cottontail rabbits do of course live here, but they are quite small. Too small to produce a 7' "stride" when butt-hopping along, and probably too small even at a run.
So, to get this 7' distance between prints, you'd almost have to have a running animal...and hares and rabbits most often dodge, rather than run in direct lines (the better to avoid hawks and such). Food for thought.
*************************************
I was interested in the measurements: 23 & 12 and 19 &10, both of which give you a ratio of about .5, so they are consistent with the vast majority of Sasquatch tracks.
(Which is like finding light hair at a murder scene and saying it is consistent with the prime suspect being a blonde.....oh, well.)
I suppose you could return during mud season (spring) and see what animals live there...if you find a lot of hare prints you'd know what animal probably made the tracks...but there's always a chance you'd find something more fun.
*******************************
Great photos! Thanks!
seeing is believing |
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 13th, 2009 09:19 PM |
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Great post Andy! Thanx for sharing your knowledge. I will be monitoring this area closely, as there has been some other activity close by - inconclusive at this point in time (like the tracks), but none-the-less intriguing.
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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pbarnard
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5
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| Posted: March 23rd, 2009 12:49 PM |
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Hi my name is Paul B. I work for a Canadian university. This is my first posting.
I am looking at the tracks from Ontario. Any chance you could be more specific as to the location? I live NW of Toronto (in Waterloo).
Any idea on how far these tracks go? I have seen a fair number of animal tracks in the snow, and I don't think these could be rabit. Rabits don't run in a straight line to far - they tend to zig-zag. Secondly, 7 feet between each track seems a long way for a rabit to keep jumping - especially over a long distance.
Perhaps these could be cougar tracks (or some other type of large cat - lynx?). These animals are capable of jumping this far and in deep snow when they land they could leave a rather large impression as they sink into the snow before they jump again (A lynx has very large paws for travel over deep snow). I have seen a cougar moving very quickly through deep snow when I happened to come across it by accident up on the Bruce Pennisula. It took 7 or 8 large jumps to get out of the clearing it was in and back into a stand of cedar trees. The tracks it left behind were 6-8 feet apart and it moved in a fairly straight line to get to the trees.
So the location of these tracks is of interest to me. I know that the Ministry of Natural Resources will not acknowledge that there are cougars up on the Bruce Pennisula, but I know 3 other people who have seen them in the Wiarton area. If you can I would talk to local hunters etc. about the presence of any big cats in this area.
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 23rd, 2009 07:43 PM |
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Paul
Did I hear you say Wiarton? Heck, that's where I went to High School! Yeah, I remember a Police Officer up there said he saw a cougar. Animals don't know borders, and consequently, will go where ever, and be where ever, they please, regardless of what the Ministry or Field Guides claim. No doubt cougars are back in Ontario!
Now, getting back on topic...
I'm sure you are aware of the ramifications should we release the location specifics - everyone would flock there, and the integrity of the area would be severely compromised. That would certainly put a damper on the research that I and a colleague are doing in that 'neck-of-the-woods'. So...sorry...but we cannot divulge that info.
I can tell you though, that you'd be surprised where the tracks were found. It's not an obvious BF location. Again, to reiterate (read above posts), because of the degradation of the tracks, it's nearly impossible to conclusively, and confidently say what made the prints. However, prior activity in the area suggests that there may indeed be BFs traipsing around.
In talking to the gentleman who took the photos, I seem to remember that he wasn't sure how far the tracks went back. I went to the area two days after I'd been contacted, and there was no sign of the tracks in the field/snow (realize that we were going through that 'melt, freeze, melt-melt, freeze' period.
I hope this helps. TODD
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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PBYodeler
Administrator
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1778
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| Posted: March 23rd, 2009 08:11 PM |
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pbarnard,
Please go to the "Read this first" section on the forum home page, read the posting guidelines and post an introduction.
PBYodeler |
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pbarnard
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5
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| Posted: March 24th, 2009 01:58 PM |
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Thanks for the reply. To bad we don't know how far the tracks went. I can understand why you can't release the location. No worries. I was surpised to hear that their might be BF activity in S. Ontario. Is this the only report or have their been other areas of S. Ontario with reported BF activitiy? I went through some of the case reports and most BF reports for Ontario seem to be in northern ontario.
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 24th, 2009 04:31 PM |
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Quote:
pbarnard wrote:
Thanks for the reply. To bad we don't know how far the tracks went. I can understand why you can't release the location. No worries. I was surpised to hear that their might be BF activity in S. Ontario. Is this the only report or have their been other areas of S. Ontario with reported BF activitiy? I went through some of the case reports and most BF reports for Ontario seem to be in northern ontario.
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If you go to bfro.net, you'll find all the posted Ontario reports listed. See reports 1340, 1615, 9516, 13627, 24881, and 1293. There was also a wave of reports from the Beamsville- Smithville area back in the mid-60s.
The gentleman who took the photos got back to me and stated that there were at least 19 prints in the track line, and that they probably went all the way across the field. I think he was amazed at what he'd found, and didn't consider following the tracks.
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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pbarnard
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5
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| Posted: March 25th, 2009 10:29 AM |
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Thanks for the reports specific to S. Ontario......I see some are are in the Beaver Valley area / Markdale area which are the closest to where I grew up. Interesting! I have spent a lot of time snowmobiling in this area and I can say that there are a lot of swamps / forests etc. up there. The land is not as "open" or "developed" as you think once you get off the road. I know an OPP officer in Markdale and their detachment gets a few reports each summer of cougars in the area (he thinks there is at least a pair of them running around. He also saw one while on patrol). So I think it would be easy for large animals to go unseen here by most people. I also see from the website that you are hosting the Ontario expedition - do you know yet where you will be going this year?
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 25th, 2009 11:32 AM |
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Quote:
pbarnard wrote:
I also see from the website that you are hosting the Ontario expedition - do you know yet where you will be going this year?
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As per BFRO policy, location details will only be given to those who register for the expedition and fill out and send in all necessary paperwork.
If you're interested in registering, you can do so via www.bfro.net.
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: March 25th, 2009 04:48 PM |
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The gentleman who took the photographs of the Ontario tracks emailed me the following information. I asked him if he'd like me to post it. He said to go ahead. Here it is...
Some things to consider when being skeptical over the tracks are a) the angle of the photos b) snow depth when they were made c) number of tracks visible d) openness of the tracks pertaining to being visible e) over-all length of the series of tracks f) the fact that there are two sets of tracks g) depth of the tracks .
Answers a) when looking directly down on the prints the outline of a footprint was very evident,hence the angles make it somewhat difficult to actually see what I saw. b) when the tracks were made there was no vegetation visible so the snow had melted approx 6-8inches before my shots . There were still a good 8 inches left of snow , so whatever made these tracks was pretty heavy. c)I counted about 19 tracks in one of the lines, I didn't follow them all the way to the tree - line d) the fact that these tracks were wide open instead of more snug to the tree line would a hare or hares be caught in the open like that. e) remember these are only the first set of prints I found two additional sets in the park in an almost straight line from the road to the trees-800yds, through 200 yds of trees , another set from the trees through an open area of about 100 yds and then one more set about 50yds through another clearing headed for the lake. f) the fact that every assumption on these tracks is times two, two hares, two bobcats, two horses, two cougars, two bears or could it be two sasquatches? It's easier to contemplate which would be traveling in pairs. g) lastly on some photos I have the snow had melted to the ground where the footprints had made contact in over 12 inches of snow when they were originally made. It would have taken something very, very heavy to do this. When I was in the park I saw numerous tracks of man, dog, deer other small game, these were all still very visible on the snow but the heat generated by the feet of the squatches and their body weight contributed to their tracks melting first.
Some comments were based on a track or one set of tracks . I think a few readers don't realize the tracks run parallel to one another about 30' apart . I think this important when concluding in one's mind what made these tracks , also the different sizes denote two animals not one.
I hope this clears up some confusion and sheds more light on the realism of these photos, if you were there at the time when I took them you would understand why I am so convinced of their authenticity.
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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LeeD
Approved
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 45
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| Posted: March 31st, 2009 10:35 PM |
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Quote:
pbarnard wrote:
I was surpised to hear that their might be BF activity in S. Ontario. Is this the only report or have their been other areas of S. Ontario with reported BF activitiy? I went through some of the case reports and most BF reports for Ontario seem to be in northern ontario.
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For what it's worth, 'pbarnard', I have collected several unreported sightings and encounters from the Thames River Watershed / London area, the Rouge River watershed / Markham area and up through Orangeville potato country.
Again, as in a great many cases, where so-called 'monsters' are not supposed to exist, witnesses hesitate to come forward to risk exposing themselves to ridicule. I have had more than one personal up close encounter and several sightings in Southern Ontario over several decades. Don't be too surprised about where they might turn up. They range far and wide in the Province.
LeeD
You can shake it, you can break it, you can hang it on the wall... |
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todd0329
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 96
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| Posted: April 1st, 2009 12:02 AM |
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LeeD,
It would be great if you could share some of your reports, via private message. It might be interesting to compare notes. I encourage you to also visit www.bfro.net to submit a report.
(Edited by todd0329)
TODD PRESCOTT, BFRO Investigator (Ontario, Quebec, Manitoba, etc)
2009 Ontario Expedition Organizer/Host |
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pbarnard
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5
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| Posted: April 1st, 2009 01:41 PM |
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LeeD - thanks for the info. on your reports in S. Ontario. I was under the impression that most BF activity was in BC and other similar areas. I live in Kitchener / Wellington County and never heard anything about BF activity in S. Ontario until I ran across this website. If you have the time you should post what you know in the reports section as Todd suggested. I would love to read them. Could you give me any idea as to when the last sighting happened?
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LeeD
Approved
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 45
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| Posted: April 1st, 2009 11:49 PM |
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Quote:
pbarnard wrote:
I was under the impression that most BF activity was in BC and other similar areas. |
Back in the days of Louse Camp and the rising BF awareness of the late 1950s it was commonly held that the PNW was the general abode of fuzzyman, if he existed at all. But as John Green was soon to point out with his first book publication (circa 1968?) that misconception was about to change. For it was Green who gathered the research which at that time already claimed BF sightings in all Canadian Provinces except Nfld. and every State but Hawaii, mostly going back a great many years. For what it's worth, those two exceptions have now at least tentatively been brought into the sightings fold, as well.
In a much broader sense, it was Ivan T. Sanderson who gave the rest of the world something to think about with his most excellent 1961 publication, 'The Abominable Snowman: Legend Come To Life'. A highly educated professional naturalist and specimen gatherer for museums, zoos and other exhibits, he set to the task of gathering together for the very first time what information concerning proto-hominids he could find from around the world. Too bad about the bombastic title and the horrific cover graphic they put on the reprint a few years ago, because this is probably the single best and most comprehensive book on the global subject that has yet been produced by any seasoned professional.
Nonetheless, if you do nothing more than read about the history of BFRO sojourns into the woods over the past number of years you will already know how widespread the BF phenomenon really is throughout North America -- especially and surprisingly so in Ontario; a fact which is only slowly making itself apparent.
As for Ontario sightings, just Google 'Ontario Bigfoot' and you will pick up Ontario's own BF website formed only a couple of years ago. They've collected 75+ sightings if memory serves me. My own experiences tell me that represents but a tiny fraction of what could be told.
As for my own experiences I will only mention that my first close up, face to face, encounter was on the way to Kindergarten when I was 4 years, 9 1/2 months old. Rather than going the long way around via the road I took the cut through the forest and came up short as I rounded a turn where a tree had freshly fallen, completely blocking the path -- a tree that had been standing the day before.
The ragged rootball rose up about 8 feet and from behind this coign of vantage our hairy friend popped his head up and emerged. I don't remember much about it any more -- it was so long ago and quite frankly, traumatizing in the extreme -- but I saw the same silver-white colored old fellow 5 years later while in the company of my next door neighbor, so I then knew I hadn't dreamed or hallucinated the whole thing.
This was in Oakridge Acres, at the time a new suburb at the western outskirts of London, Ontario, on the north side of and abutting the Thames River; about a quarter mile from Ferguson's Pond and maybe a half mile from what is now called the Sifton Bog (back then it used to be called the Byron Bog before the land developer, Sifton, bought it and renamed it a couple of decades ago). It was all open fields, meadows, pasture and forest.
If you Google-Earth 'Sifton Bog, Ontario, Canada' you can catch today's bird's eye view, but it's now completely surrounded by development, which pains me, given how beautiful it was in its former natural state. Ah, the price of progress.
I estimate this would have happened probably in about the third week of September, 1955. Apparently someone else reported a similar unpublished sighting to Dr. John Bindernagel which supposedly took place in the same area around the same time - the clincher for me was that the other sighting was also of a white Big Guy; not a very common BF colour. I felt vindicated by that fact alone.
As for the question of contributing my bunch of unpublished BF stories from B.C., Manitoba and Ontario, I don't really see the point any more. I have finally -- after many years of being 'weirded out' by the whole thing -- reached a calm state of personal equilibrium on the subject. That took some doing.
I have finally arrived at a position wherein I don't really want BF to be 'discovered', per se. I am satisfied that I know where and how to find him, should the spirit move me, and that's good enough for me. I think he is better off as he is, without his pesky little cousin making life any more miserable for him than we already have. I have made my mind up that I will not knowingly contribute to the 'kill' side of the question where, inevitably, all of this must eventually lead, imho.
LeeD
You can shake it, you can break it, you can hang it on the wall... |
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pbarnard
Approved
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5
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| Posted: April 2nd, 2009 01:04 PM |
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LeeD thanks for all the info. , the mention of the Ontario website and the books etc. I will check them out.
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Derek Nightwolf W
Unregistered
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 25
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| Posted: April 24th, 2009 06:52 AM |
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| I hail from Ontario.And have seen a sasquatch twice.Once for a few seconds and the other seemed like forever.10 TO 15 feet away both times.So I know thier here.It was approx. 19 years ago but I have a feeling their still around.Just older and bigger.I have a bit of knowledge of our forgotten brothers and sisters.I have tried to get a number for BFRO with no results.Am a computer newbie so I could use some help please,from anyone!!! |
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Bossburg
Administrator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1963
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| Posted: April 24th, 2009 09:50 AM |
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Quote:
Derek Nightwolf W wrote:
I hail from Ontario.And have seen a sasquatch twice.Once for a few seconds and the other seemed like forever.10 TO 15 feet away both times.So I know thier here.It was approx. 19 years ago but I have a feeling their still around.Just older and bigger.I have a bit of knowledge of our forgotten brothers and sisters.I have tried to get a number for BFRO with no results.Am a computer newbie so I could use some help please,from anyone!!!
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Please visit this link: http://www.bfro.net/GDB/submitfm.asp
There you will be able to report your sightings and an investigator in your area will call you. There is a phone number listed on the bfro.net home page but using the submit form will get you to the correct investiagor much quicker.
Thanks,
Bossburg |
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toejam
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 40
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| Posted: December 25th, 2009 10:02 PM |
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| From what I've learned about BF's proximity, I'm surprised there aren't more reports out of Ontario. I saw this thread and couldn't find any link to the photos that are spoken about. Could someone please show me where a link is? Thanks |
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Barb Kaz
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toejam
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 40
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| Posted: December 26th, 2009 01:14 PM |
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| Thank you Barb |
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borntorun
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 5
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| Posted: January 4th, 2010 11:47 PM |
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| Looks like a four legged animal in full sprint, either Large cat or Rabbit. The line is too straight between print to print and cats and rabbitts will have less zig zag when running. After a bit of snow melt the entry portions of the initial contact with the front and rear paws will usually melt deeper and faster giving you the impression of deeper heal and toe impressions. |
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